SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I hate that Im back on here after several years. My wife devistated me in Dec 2015, I found out she was having an affair at that time. We went through a lot. Most painful time of my life while trying to raise a young family. She was remorseful, we went to counseling together, I believed she was sorry, still do.... Fast forward to recently... I felt somthing was different. My wife has been through a lot in the last several years...lots of work stress, elderly mother becoming more needy...no time for herself at all, be being more abbrassive and somewhat of an asshole at times, my heart has been slightly hardened from my experience... But in the last month I began to notice some changes. She seemed nicer to me. Less cranky and less resistant to my advances, and grab assing. More smiles. Main reason that I noticed and was concerned of this was because it was similar to the time right before i discovered her affair 6 years ago. At the time I thought we were having the best year of our marriage...sex was great, i was so in love with her. Being through that "ptsd", I couldnt help but think about it now when I noticed the changes. So one evening a few days ago I decided to snoop in her phone. I noticed in her email an email to herself with a picture of another guy.... This guy had a big mustache. In her search history I found "mustache ride", and "cum". When i discovered what "mustache ride" meant I immiedietdly had dreadful thoughts....almost couldnt breathe...flashback of the feelings of 6 years ago when I first discovered the original affair. I wanted to hold off confronting her until I could find more evidence, but I couldnt wait. She admitted to talking to a friend that she knew for 20 years, she said they were just friends, i've known of this friend. She said she just enjoyed talking to him because she didnt have to talk about real world stuff, like the stresses of life, or her mother. But what bothered me was she lied and hid it from me, they communicated through instagram messenger and she deleted their conversations. I discovered they had one instagram video chat at one point. I feel like I believe her, but I feel betrayed that she decieved me about this. I also remember that she lied about the original affair at each piece of new evidence I discovered. We went through a lot together over the years. I know she knows that there are situations you dont put yourself in, we've both talked about it and shes been very vocal about it. I understand her position of wanting a friend to talk to. She doesnt have girl friends, has always enjoyed the less drama male friendships.

Im hurt that she tried to hide this from me, it's awakened emotions that I havent felt since after the affair of 2015. Im trying to be understanding an open minded but Im also fearful, fearful of her opening her heart to another man and what that can lead to. Im hurt that when I explain that to her and tell her if she really wants to talk to him I wont stop her, but that she doesn't say she wont. I believe she's sincere in what she says, but I also know what can happen regardless of intent and what shes capable of. This "friend" is a also married with a family, my wife didnt have his number, nor did he have hers. Since there was no question on his part why they communicated via instagram messenger, i question his motives as well. It's been several days since I looked at her phone...Im a wreck.

[This message edited by iHurtDec3 at 7:07 AM, Wednesday, November 3rd]

Her behavior is extremely inappropriate given her history of cheating. She needs to find girlfriends. In my opinion, she lost her right to have male friends six years ago. She must go NC with this guy. She should do it willingly and apologize for hiding this "friendship." You should not allow this behavior to continue. Again, if she is truly into strengthening the marriage she should be all in on this request. If she isn't, you have a real problem. Do not rug sweep this latest incident. She should spend the rest of her time with you behaving like a safe partner. She is not doing that. Don't let this slide. You may be afraid of what you may uncover. Don't be.

How did she explain the mustache ride and cum search?

Is her friend local?

[This message edited by MickeyBill2016 at 7:35 AM, Wednesday, November 3rd]

Your wife is in the midst of at least an EA - possibly a PA. But you know that already. The question is: what are you going to do about it this time? She has proven to be untrustworthy - despite you giving her a second chance, she has lied to you, hid her communication with this OM, and actively tried to hide her tracks by deleting her messages. Does this sound like a remorseful wife to you? To me, she sounds like a classic serial cheater. The sooner you recognize that and take action, the better.

I don't know what your previous story was but I can say there are a lot of red flags again. You are already aware of that.

She acted like she did when she cheated and your gut told you something is going on. And when you researched, you saw that you are not mistaken, you found concrete evidence. What you found is at least evidences of EA. We don't know if it turns PA yet, but given her search history, that's definitely on that way. The deleted texts indicate that there is something inappropriate out there, probably the proofs for PA and/or sexting, if not then at least things you wouldn't like to see.

Refusing NC is another huge red flag. Despite the fact that she has cheated on you in the past she doesn't care about you and what you might feel. It really makes the situation worse.

You shouldn't ignore all this red flags. You should definitely not accept this situation and show it to her. You can say that you can't force her to do anything, that she can do whatever she wants, but not as your wife. Depending on her reaction to this (not only with words but also with her actions), you determine your direction.

Good luck.

[This message edited by guvensiz at 3:21 AM, November 3rd (Wednesday)]

I discovered they had one instagram video chat at one point.

What was her excuse of this one? Was she defensive? Minimise? What was her reason to go from texting to video? Why not phone? Couldn’t be work multitasking reasons because you can still text/talk without needing to switch to video. Couldn’t be curiosity over looks because she could see his pics on Instagram. When was it? Where was it? That is just too suspicious especially when her google search revealed what she is looking up, could he have vid masturbated with her, dirty talked about "moustache ride" and she looked it up afterwards? A tell of my WH was he would pick up new sayings, knew about unusual out of the box things thanks to his associations with his OW, could this be the case here? Have you mentioned the search history? If so how did she explain knowing about that term? It’s pretty niche and wouldn’t be raised in most conversations.

You’re back in shock, drink water and avoid alcohol and keep distance until you’re ready to make life changing decisions, allow the shock and pain to pass before any significant confrontation. Unsure if you checked it out last time but revisit the healing library, I still bring up articles to read to centre me when it becomes overwhelming. Do you have a spare room? Distance really helps with decision making and the last thing you need right now is her insincere niceties that are triggering you, space will get you away from that.

Very sorry you’re back

[This message edited by LostInHisFog at 11:16 AM, Wednesday, November 3rd]

In this situation, and with my WW’s history, she would get kicked to the curb instantly…if it were me.

That’s all I’ll say.

The consequence of her allowing the friendship to become romanticized/sexualized is that it must end with 100% NC.

And it's non negotiable.

Plus, since she abused social media, she must give that up too.

With respect to her having all male friends. It's not because it's less drama, it's because she's addicted to getting attention from men. And that need for attention is a slippery slope that places her marriage at high risk for infidelity.

Humans are hot wired to bond physically and emotionally. Her recent behavior is playing with fire. She likely believes it's harmless fun and she is in control. However, experience shows it's also high risk behavior and can escalate quickly.

You both should read and discuss: "Not Just Friends" by Dr Shirley Glass.

It's about couples (good people) that experienced infidelity. It's not just some author's opinion. It's based on solid studies. Among other things, it suggests certain boundaries/behaviors to protect a marriage from infidelity.

[This message edited by Robert22205https at 12:33 PM, Wednesday, November 3rd]

It's not just no. Or NO. It's F*** NO.

She has not made herself safe for the marriage. I hope it hasn't progressed beyond what you know already... but does it really matter? What she's done is enough, particularly with her history.

It sounds like you have not come to that conclusion yet or you fear taking a hard line with this. But it is painfully obvious to all of us reading this thread. You are back in infidelity based on what you have evidence of already, regardless of what she tells you.

Take firm action now and be confident about it.

I am sorry you are back - just the title of your post stabbed my stomach.

Since you been down this road, look hard at what the rules were that were established during your R. There should have been pretty strong boundaries set for your to be able to move forth with your R. What were the consequences if any of those boundaries were crossed?

Reading what you found so far, I find it hard to believe she has not crossed many of the rules that were set in place. If so, look at what consequences were set and follow them. There is no sense having boundaries/consequences if they are not going to be followed.

Even without her past - she knows darn well this is not appropriate M behavior. But factor in her past - red flags a-waving.

I am so sorry you are dealing with this again. I really feel for you. I played that game for 9 years (too long).

It's the lies and deceit that get you in the end!!

Looks like it's a cycle and it's starting again - you know what happened last time and you know the pain!!

What is her thoughts on this situation? How successful has reconciliation really been, only you know the answer to this but in light of the current 'contact' - what has changed?

You do know the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different outcome!

I can speak only for myself here, as a BH.

There won’t be a second reconciliation for me. I’m putting everything I have into the one I’m in now. If my WW is not also all in on this reconciliation, I’m out, for good.

I hope this turns out well for you. I know how complicated these things are.

And on and on it goes.

You’re just going to have to ask yourself how much abuse you are willing to accept.

You can run around in circles trying to puzzle all this out, or just accept she’s cheating and probably has done it before and is likely to do it again.

I’m five years out. Where my head and heart are, if my WW did it again and I found out, I would not play marriage cop. I would file on her as soon as humanly possible, and get out.

I recommend what I now think of as "the golden cage strategy" (to borrow a term from Bigger). Open the cage door and walk away. And don’t look back.

IHD, honestly, I think you need to slow down on believing her. She doesn't sound believable. Why in the world was she picturing mustache rides while looking at this guy's picture? Probably because they talked about it meaning this is at least an EA. Possibly PA. She deleted the conversations because she knew how bad they were. Would she be willing to take a polygraph test to prove to you that no EA/PA lines were crossed with this OM?

I don't know what your W is actually doing, but you see the red flags, right?

What did she do to heal 6 years ago? What did she do to change from cheater to good partner? If she did little or nothing, she can make that change now. If she changes from cheater to good partner now, R is possible, if you want it.

But R will require a lot of work from both of you. You need to set boundaries for yourself, and you need to maintain them. You have to stop explaining, because she doesn't need them - an adult human being knows how to treat a partner or knows that they have to ask the partner how they want to be treated. You'll need to decide to assert yourself.

Your W will need to identify the obstacles to being a good partner that are inside her head, and she'll have to knock those obstacles down one by one.

Most of us think we'll give our WSes one chance and split if they ruin their one chance. You don't have to do that, but ... what's keeping you from setting firm boundaries? WHat's keeping you from splitting now?